what would i do with an established church?
I was asked this question recently in an interview
“If you were asked to steer a conventional, western church on a missional path and were given the freedom to utilize or reallocate all funds and resources in the best way you felt this could be accomplished, how and what would you do?
You have three staff members and a lien-free building. And the building is located in a neighborhood where few members actually live.”
And here is my answer…
The issue of change and transition into missional forms of church is fraught with many complex problems. But again, at the heart of the problem is our ‘idea of church’—the conception we have of what it means to be God’s people as a community. Part of the problem is that we have so associated our idea of church with the institutional forms of it (including programs, services, professionalization of ministry, theologies, denominational templates, etc.) that we need to at least be given the chance to experience each other as Jesus’ church divorced from the predominance of the institution of the church.
Having said this, I do believe the building can present a real problem—for one, it staticizes our idea of church. I would certainly have the building in my sights. But that would be just one thing—the heart of my strategy would be to try to communicate a more primal and organic idea of church and mission because I think that is more who we truly are meant to be. You no doubt know that wonderful quote from Antoine de Saint Extupery “If you want to build a ship, don’t summon people to buy wood, prepare tools, distribute jobs, and organize the work, rather teach people the yearning for the wide, boundless ocean.” The unfolding of Christianity as the means by which people are re-connected to God has nothing to do with the institutionalized idea of church in the first instance. We need to recover our most basic, and dangerous, forms of church—that of an apostolic movement. It’s the story of the church and her mission that I outline in The Forgotten Ways. I would tell and retell of that story and then lets see what happens!
But here’s my general advice to people in this situation (note the 6 P’s you 3-B Baptists out there 
)
- You need to get the right paradigm. (Clearly getting our ‘idea/conception’ of church right before we start is critical–as per comments above)
- You need to be prayerful (It’s God’s work and God’s church, prayer is vital. Especially corporate prayer around these issues: we must come before the Lord of the Church)
- You need to be patient (it ain’t going to happen overnight, but if you stick in there, and be consistent in your activism, it will/might eventually happen.)
- You need to be very practical (Do something, don’t shout your mouth off. The best critique of the bad is the practice of the better)
- You need to have some power (in any institution, you had better have some form of social power to change things. Otherwise, frustration will become your food and cynicism will follow)
- You need to have a darn good plan (don’t just be a change agent, be a change manager. For large and complex organizations, this might take years. So buckle in.)
Anyone else suggest some other things we could do?
Forgotten Ways, The: Reactivating the Missional Church - Alan Hirsch
Forgotten Ways Handbook, The: A Practical Guide for Developing Missional Churches - Alan Hirsch, Darryn Altclass
ReJesus: A Wild Messiah for a Missional Church - Michael Frost, Alan Hirsch
The Shaping of Things to Come: Innovation and Mission for the 21 Century Church - Michael Frost, Alan Hirsch
I’ll do my best, and I’ll keep you posted (in this thread). Thank you for your prayers.
Alan, I don’t know, but I think I heard some talk about a ticket. Anyways it’s your blog so I guess it is you who should be offering the prize…
OK. Here’s a further question:
I work with an organisation that produces training courses and home group courses. (www.facingthechallenge.org). Most of our users are probably in fairly institutional churches. We’re thinking about developing a course that will help people in this setting *begin* to think missionally. (There’s simply no point in being too radical about it - all it will do is scare and alienate). So if you were planning a course like this, and you could make 6-8 simple but practical suggestions that would encourage people to think and act missionally, what would they be? This needs to be for ordinary church members, not for church leaders.
OK Dave, I will start off….
Begin to hang out regularly at some third place. Get to know the locals and become part of the tribe.
Alan, is that like Friendship evangelism? Is this what thinking missionally is - the old friendship evangelism?
I think I would want the course to begin to see people as made by God, and not as potential converts…in essence love people period.
To me it’s not a strategy - It’s not hang out with Julie next door at the tennis courts and see if I can get her to come to the church barbeque/cell group. It’s a complete reorientation, a mental shift, a sense of ‘I belong out there with that crowd.’ To me it is that that navigates us from potentially phony agenda’d friendships to unconditional lovingkindness.
Dave, I said it’s a start–not the whole shebang. One of the things we have to encourage people to do get out of our comfort zone and learn the lost arts of incarnation. that’s what loving people is all about.
Alan, how do we begin to learn to do what the world does naturally ie: incarnation, how did we get to the place as people where we lost touch with the world around us?
Do you think that when people become christians they go through a reprogramming? Is this then what missional life is about - becoming de-programmed
Sometimes (I know this is off topic - but hey we can go off topic) I think that we as christians have been the ones who may have exchanged truth for a lie. God wakes us up, Jesus appears full of grace, and we sign up for church
How do you de-program something?
Grace
Dave
Sometimes I think we are so trapped in the “it’s all about me” milieu of our culture that even our beginning attempts to be “missional” are subtly (and unconsciously)critiqued using this grid. I think I find that true of myself anyway.
” how did we get to the place as people where we lost touch with the world around us?”
Is it because we stopped seeing God in it, God working in it, suffering in it? The world became bad, the enemy, that which is to be given up by true Christians. If I can’t see Christ in Harry, drunk on the beach this morning surrounded by beer cans, his face having taken a few punches last night, then I’ve stopped thinking God is out there in messy humanity, and instead can only be found in the convent or the church building?
Hey Espen, what are you studying?
I’ll give some study tips if I may… from someone who was a terribly disorganised student, and then, in a major act of hypocrisy, became a teacher.
The difference between students who perform well and those who don’t usually comes down to good habits. It’s an incredibly boring secret. I wish there was a more glamorous one.
To pick a random figure…
If the average student does 2 hours of study, 6 days a week, the above average student does 3 hours of study, 6 days a week. Over a semester they have clocked up over 100 hours of engaging with their study material more than the average student… it’s a significant difference that a last minute swot can’t make up.
The discipline doesn’t have to be in one block… they might be on a train for 1/2 an hour day and night… and while the average student might look out the window and listen to music, the above average student will look over their lecture notes, write summaries, draw flow charts, draw pictures or diagrams to help them remember facts, develop acrostics to help them remember facts, read and summarise the relevant section of their text book etc. All this time adds up.
As implied too… it’s not just extra time (which is the main thing) but it’s time well spent in ACTIVE learning… discussing things with fellow students, trying sample exam questions, writing up summaries, etc.
Then there’s the attitude stuff… “I can’t do this” is a block. “If I try my hardest and fail then I’LL be a failure, so I won’t try too hard” (that is a really common, but unvoiced fear, behind a huge amount of university drop out.) Prayer and trust makes a difference… “Lord, if you’ve called me to this, you’ll help me to do it.”
Some courses are so overloaded with assignments it’s hard to exam study at all… which is another obstacle (and not the fault of the student).
Hey Janet,
thanks for your tips. I am in the first year of medicine, we are 2600 students and only the 400 best will be able to continue in the second year. After the first semester I was classed 700, so I need to gain 300 places. As I said, it is possible even though it is difficult. My biggest obstacle was, until about february, the attitude, when discouraged it is difficult to do my best. And the whole competition system was also very hard to get used to (I am not french).
But I had one experience where I managed to work well and continue even though I was discouraged (with the help of God), and after that I haven’t been discouraged at all. Now I have the peace in my heart that God is in control and my job is to do my best. As you say trust really makes a difference.
I don’t know how much the average student works (but then the average student is not even close), but my friends try to work 10 hours 7 days per week. But I am not sure if it’s healthy so I try to find the good balance.
10 hours 7 days a week!!!!!!! Gosh… I don’t know how you’d avoid burnout (ignore all my comments stated with high school students in mind!)
That’s certainly about working smarter not harder… and trusting God.
Dave… I’ve been mulling over your question… I do wonder whether one should start with working on the theological questions rather than “6-8 simple but practical suggestions”. I do think we become more like the one we focus out love and attention upon. So is our image of God a missional God… a relational God… one who so loved the world He gave… a perfect Father… a Christ-like God, the friend of tax collectors and sinners?
Or does our God maintain institutions… is our God a judge, a harsh task master, a legalist?
I wonder if a series on “The missional God” might be a way to start?
I also think learning to listen to the Holy Spirit (and then doing as you’re told) isn’t a bad place to start… although some churches find that concept a bit spooky!
If you really are constrained by “practical suggestions” there’s plenty in of these in the gospels… go to parties like Jesus did, eat with people, give to someone without expecting anything back, “go the extra mile”, practice hospitality… etc. etc.
Thanks for these suggestions. Janet - I’m sure you’re right about starting with the incarnational God. However, I do believe the practical suggestions are also important: mostly, the people around us (me, at least) in institutional church are sincere in their commitment to Christ, and in their desire to follow him — they just can’t see how you can ‘do church’ differently. So I would like to put some specific ideas in front of them.
One of the ways I’ve been trying to home in on this recently is by asking ‘What do you think the church will look like in ten years’ time? What should it look like? What would we need to do differently now to get there?’ It’s really to answer this last question that I want to be able to suggest possible ways forward.
Blessings
I have a practical question rather than a point and that is what do we know about the financial implications of an established church turning around into a missional/incarnational etc stance?
Is it an inevitable drain on the church financially? Can the newer forms of - what would be effectively small plants in their own right - pay their own way, never mind pay into the older congregation?
I gather from speaking to the Church Army here in the UK it is the case that some, for example cafe churches, have not only broken even but paid back into supporting the mother church, but these are unusual.
This would be a critical area here, as we have in UK and in rural areas specially such a high proportion of congregations in our denom. dipping below financial viability and with small and aging congregations.
Blessings
Hey, Alan and all!
Scot McKnight is blogging about this subject over at: http://www.jesuscreed.org/?p=2274
I gave him a heads-up about this thread, so I thought I should give you a heads-up about his!
Be blessed,
Hey Bro, I feel sorry for the church that would have you as a pastor! Just kidding! I would go to your church bro, and that is saying a lot cause I couldn’t go to to many churches.
There needs to be an intentional detox to get a church turned around and missional again. Aside from the missional paradigmns the people of God typically have a dependency issue where they are unable to hear from God without a teacher and they also tend to only feel used by God when they are doing stuff. Hearing God’s voice and intimacy with Him is absolutely essential.
Just a thot.
I’ve had my first two exams today and I think it went very well, thank you for your prayers Janet and Peggy! Three more to go monday…
Blessings to you, Espen! Thank you for keeping in touch. May these days leading up to three exams on Monday be full of rest, good food, healthy study/review and peace that God will be there for you each step of the way.
I will continue to keep you in my prayers.
Amen!
I have linked to this question: