fire or fire?
In our reflection today, Debs and I read 1 Peter 1
which has so much to say about the connection between suffering and sanctification. The mystery of joy, of being saved, in the midst of sometimes severe suffering is surely the mark of a saint. But on reflecting on how many people we know who have given up the faith because of their inability (or unwillingness) to integrate redemptive suffering into their lives, we noticed another thing; namely that the more holy we become the more we will suffer. This is so because holiness conforms us to the nature of God, and in a fallen and as yet unredeemed world, that puts us at odds, not only with ourselves in some way, but also with our contexts. Because of this, God’s redeeming and sanctifying actions in our lives are experienced as a form of burning, of being purged, or as T.S.Elliot says below, we are “…redeemed from fire by fire.”
Here is my favorite T.S.Elliot piece. It so profoundly captures the human experience of holiness and redemption.
The dove descending breaks the air
With flame of incandescent terror
Of which the tongues declare.
The one discharge from sin and error
The only hope, or else despair
Lies in the choice of pyre or pyre–
To be redeemed from fire by fireWho then devised the torment? Love
Love is the unfamiliar Name
Behind the hands that wove
The intolerable shirt of flame
Which human power cannot remove
We only live, only suspire
Consumed by either fire or fire
—T.S.Elliot, Little Gidding,iv.
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This is, I think, one of the most important pastoral concepts needed today.
Not only, though, is it not communicated oftentimes the exact opposite is communicated. Those who are suffering or enduring hardship and troubles are excluded from participation or leadership in the church. If in fact it is the pattern of God for those who are the most advanced, or advancing, to endure such things then the patterns of our churches are excluding those who can contribute the very most holiness (if not time/energy/enthusiasm).
Which leaves our communities becoming limited by the mediocre among us.
One of the monks from long ago wrote that this is true in regards to temptations too. Those who are tempted the most often have the most to offer the Kingdom. They are tempted and attacked because they are dangerous. Only temptation and attack is seen as a sign of weakness and disfavor, so it is those who fight no great battles who are made into officers. Again, the mediocre leading into mediocrity.
All because we are scared of suffering and challenge in our lives and in the lives of others.
Alan, wonderful poem and what Patrick says captures important truth for us as Christ’s body. I will echo his claims and further add that we have little resource in contemporary western faith to deal with desolation as a precious gift from God. The immediate and incarnation-denying reaction to suffering is that of abandonment. How could God forsake me? Rather than embracing our crosses and suffering we reject them as curses. It is in our misunderstanding of what blessing and presence are that lead us astray and your thoughts, the poetry of Elliott and what Partick says is a breath of fresh air and precisely the prophetic utterance that is needed….
True guys, we were reflecting about so many of the people we know who were struggling with sexual orientation issues. That for so many of them, the desire and the move towards holiness was a painful choice. Many of them could not integrate pain into their lives. But here, in 1 Peter, it is seen as integral to the maturing process.
And Parick, given your writing on the Holy Spirit, how is this poem in relation to the Spirit eh?! Its all about the role of the Sanctifying Spirit (a legitimate Hebraized translation of hagia pvneumata. )
Love the poem! The key symbols and imagery packed succinctly together. Romans 7
and Romans 8
contrasted, fire or fire.
Brilliant. That’s it exactly. The Spirit is bringing us to God, bringing the world to God. Through fire or fire.
I’m adding that to the 2nd edition.
I totally think that the Holy Spirit needs legitimate Hebraization in a lot of ways. Active force, not passive liturgical tool.
i wonder if we can link jesus’ councel to the struggling church in laodicea “come buy gold refined in the fire” (Rev 3:18
)? Peter says it is our faith that is tested and refined, and it is of greater worth than gold. Is the ‘gold refined by fire’ refered to by jesus actually a counsel to embrace the testing that will come when we plunge into the pyre of pure love which is a life totally submitted to Him? In terms of the result for the church of Laodicea - they will get very hot!
Suffering produces perserverance, perserverance character and character hope. Hope does not disapoint us. That sums it up right there.
Alan, Patrick and all…I have been pondering this a lot in the past month, using the term “Purple Martydom”…and Brad has weighed in some at his blog, as well. It is truly amazing to see the strength and importance of this neglected and unpopular truth.
I think it interesting to remember that we are to be born again of water and fire…water, which is one form of purification…fire, which is another form of purification.
This “water” gently washes away that which has caked onto the outside, but does not dissolve the yet-recognizable form of the “cracked Eikon”, as Scot McKnight says.
The fire, on the other hand, consumes that which is unseen–inside us, in our heart and soul and mind–which is impure, transforming us, reshaping us into the image of Christ, revealing the “true Eikon” that we are already-not yet becoming.
Wow….
Interesting timing, since my reading through the Bible with the little boys has arrived at Job. It is challenging to process this book with them, but Job has always been one of my favorites (misery does indeed love godly company) and his story is very timely for boys who focus on whether something is fair or not…as is God’s eventual rebuke of the “wisdom” of Job’s friends. I think some of the health/wealth crew should come along and take a clear look at the foil God has provided us in Job’s story!
Alan…I am grateful for the thinking that your posts inspire–and hope that you don’t mind the Abbess dragging them home for further processing!
I think there is a lot to be explored in the link between enduring ordeals and discipleship growth.
There is lots of talk in terms of liminality in ritual in emerging church circles but when you look at the sociological literature, many of the rituals identified by them as fostering liminality and communitas involved shared ordeals, shared suffering.
All too often in today’s church we seek to cushion members from ordeal and discomfort. We need to emotionally come to grips with the fact that ’saving’ people from discomfort is sometimes unhelpful and unhealthy. We need to walk besides our friends in their suffering not flee it.
Matt…exactly!
Back to parenting examples…we cannot protect our children from all harm. They have to learn how to fall and pick themselves up or they can never gain any confidence.
When I returned home from the mission field (28 years ago), it was almost two years before someone was actually willing to hear my stories about how difficult it was and how much I learned from the pain and how it resulted in a brokenness and a change in how I perceived everything. For the rest, they just didn’t want to hear about the hard things…and that delayed my ability to really process what had happened and come to grips with it…being someone who learns and understands by processing with others.
…back to my ideas on having the right mix of order and chaos
This message is so counter-cultural.
In the West most “work” does not involve the aches of serious physical toil. As for the daily survival stuff… cold and hot water pours out of our taps, we can heat houses at the flick of a switch, we have endless labour saving machines, we have prepackaged foods grown elsewhere, cars rather than feet (or horses) take us where we want to go.
Then there are painkillers available for any aches that still come our way. As for psychic pain… well doctors will put people on sedatives or antidepressants with few questions asked to mask this.
This is not all bad of course… but it instills in us the idea that pain is always bad and pain is always to be avoided. Pain for we Westerners is an enemy, not a purifying friend.
There are churches that communicate God has a wonderful plan for your life… God wants to bless you… God wants to make you prosperous… if this is not unpacked in biblical terms (and it often is not!) we can be led to think God wants us even happier, even richer, and even more self-indulgent than we already are.
Jesus gives us life… and when you have a taste of real life you’re hooked. But real life is painful, and I unconsciously flee from it sometimes because I’m a creature of the Western world, and I like my pillows soft and my yoke not only light but padded and satin-lined.
Isn’t part of suffering than about others not having to suffer?
When John looked up at the cross while our Lord was naked, defenseless, and blameless, you think he remembered wanting to rain down fire on those who would deny Jesus?
Vulnerability is scary as hell! We resent the fact that we need something and strike out at the very thing that filled that need.
Going to the cross is huge! I’ll never forget the pain when I stood accused and convicted. A seperation from God that I would not wish on my worst enemy. The heart of Christ bleed not just physically but to the depth of His very soul. Something we can never comprehend.
Jesus experienced the depths of hell for us. I can’t help thinking that when He judges He will do it rightly because He knows the depth of that seperation from the Love of Our Father.
I would think Jesus was a freak if I believed He wanted to suffer like that. He did it so we wouldn’t have to. When God spoke to me, He said,”You will suffer much but it will never compare to mine, and there are many who will.” I’m certainly not a martyr, I hate being vulnerable, but I try to work through suffering so others don’t have to.
You are so right Janet, I feel the same as you when I lay my head down on my soft pillow.
Penney, I think we have to consider that Jesus suffered for us in two ways: first, that we would be spared further and eternal separation from God. But secondly, that we would be willing to suffer for others, because he suffered for us.
Yes, Janet, incarnational suffering is VERY counter-cultural! But it is in the deed of denying self for “other” that God’s mission “goes out” into the darkness. It is first shown in those who are in Christ who are willing to set aside their wants in order for the needs of others to be met. And then, when folks wonder at someone being willing to be “put out” for them, that the opportunity to introduce them to the Exemplar arises.
Our suffering will never be in the same league as Jesus…but how does one pick up one’s cross and follow Jesus without embracing the notion of suffering and weakness and vulnerability? We just cannot prevent suffering; we can, however, allow God to hallow our suffering and use it for good. (So Romans 8:28
)
One of my favorite sermons was preached on Mother’s Day entitled “Joy through Loss” and talked about the whole process of “necessary losses” we encounter in life. (HT to Judith Voirst’s book by that title–great book!) No woman “wants” to suffer the pains of childbirth!
BTW, I am convinced that is why many women don’t tell others about their experiences–for fear of scaring them away! And this is one of the factors behind the increase of both C-sections and epidurals, IMO.
But the miracle that brings that baby into existence is just so powerful…and all the continued suffering that goes along with parenting is a kind of purification by fire (see Alan’s “fire or fire?” post) that helps us grow up and begin to understand God as Father…even if it’s just a bit.
Suffering, in and of itself, is not the point (and why I tend to clash with some of the monastic and mystic orders who practice extreme deprivation). Just as privilege is given for purpose, so suffering is embraced for purpose. If we separate the two, we get distortions on both sides.
I am somehow daily reminded of the blessing it is to my life that I lived for two years (1977-79) without hot water (sometimes without running water) or telephone or grocery stores or a washer and dryer and with intermittent electricity. That kind of “suffering” taught me the difference between a need and a want…and I will be forever droning on about that importance distinction. (Ask my children!)
Well, I feel like I’m babbling; and don’t even get me started on the whole health and wealth and Jabez thing!
Blessings, all
Willing to suffer? Do any of us want to? When it comes to suffering I think we can be very arrogant?
I believe that we need to be very careful and reverent when it comes to this concept?!
The Reformation is a good example!
Agreed Penney. I think that is a very good warning. It is a mystery.
Well, Penney and Alan, let me clarify a bit. I wonder if I have inadvertently struck a sensitive cord….
Are willingness to suffer and wanting to suffer the same thing? I don’t necessarily think so… I think they can be very different. Willingness connotes humble submission to what is, while wanting can involve arrogance and self-will and pride.
For me it is not about looking for suffering (which is what I was meaning about the monastics and mystics), nor a pharasaical kind of pride thing, but about recognizing it and perceiving it properly so that one can embrace the opportunity and let God redeem it. Our own suffering very often informs our ability to show mercy to others.
Certainly, I did not go looking for suffering! But it has found me and, like Paul, I have been told that God’s grace is sufficient for me and his strength is made perfect in weakness.
I think, however, of Mother Theresa as one who absolutely sought suffering… and her extreme experience remains very much a mystery.
Blessings….
This is a helpful clarification… WISHING to suffer may in fact come from a place of pride (”aren’t I a marvelous saint… so much better than all those soft, weak Christians”?) or a sense of earning God’s favour by works, or from something even more pathological (a type of self-loathing)… whereas WILLINGNESS to suffer if God’s invites us to do something against our natural inclination is a different matter. It reminds me of the covenant prayer of John Wesley:
A COVENANT PRAYER OF JOHN WESLEY
And now, beloved, let us bind ourselves with willing bonds to our covenant God, and take the yoke of Christ upon us.
This taking of His yoke upon us means that we are heartily content that He appoint us our place and work, and that He alone be our reward.
Christ has many services to be done; some are easy, others are difficult; some bring honour, some bring reproach; some are suitable to our natural inclinations and temporal interests, others are contrary to both. In some we may please Christ and please ourselves, in others we cannot please Christ except by denying ourselves. Yet the power to do all these things is assuredly given us in Christ, who strengtheneth us.
Therefore, let us make the Covenant of God our own. Let us engage our heart to the Lord, and resolve in His strength never to go back.
Being thus prepared, let us now, in sincere dependence on His grace and trusting in His promises, yield ourselves anew to Him, meekly kneeling upon our knees.
I am no longer my own, but Thine. Put me to what Thou wilt; rank me with whom Thou wilt; put me to doing, put me to suffering; let me be employed for Thee or laid aside for Thee, exalted for Thee or brought low for Thee; let me be full, let me be empty; let me have all things, let me have nothing; I freely and heartily yield all things to Thy pleasure and disposal.
And now, O glorious and blessed God, Father Son and Holy Spirit, Thou art mine, and I am Thine. So be it. And the Covenant which I have made on earth, let it be ratified in heaven.
Amen.
Two things strike me about this, no three
1/ I don’t think Jesus WANTED to suffer any more than we do, he was just WILLING to do whatever was needed to break down the barriers between humanity and God.
2/ It is inevitable that anyone who is willing to do whatever it takes to chanllenge “the system” will become a threat to it and suffer consequences. In democracies the consequences usually aren’t as dire as in dictatorships, but they are still there. Loosing your place on the corporate ladder is one that readily comes to mind, constantly putting up with heresy charges is one I and many of my buddies have to deal with (and some of them cop far more abuse than me). It just goes with the territory.
3/ Suffering is part of the apostolic job description if I read Paul right.
AMEN, Matt! Peggy, forgive me if my response seemed defensive, that was not my intent. As christians or just plain humans we all suffer at some point.
I’m finding in my own walk, that most times what I suffer through is my own vulnerability. What ever the test it usually involves my surrendering notions of God and the box I put Him in.
Like when I got stuck on my roof putting up Christmas lights. Letting go of the ladder brought about a defensive reflex. In our humanity it is a natural response to either strike back or cover our wounds. We put up fences that box in our image of God and prevents others from entering in, ie. my comparison to the reformation.
How do we love our enemies, when we ourselves are enemies to the purpose and mission of God? How do we suffer through not only extending grace but loving someone like Hitler? In my own desire to help others, at times I’ve helped others not to elevate their suffering, but because I didn’t want to suffer through the unknown.
I’ve seen my whole family come to Christ and suffer deeply through poverty, suicide, and addiction. I will never forget walking away from my own mother when she could have died. Truley suffering in that particular situation meant I had to walk away. I suffered through wanting to help her and choosing to trust and follow God. I didn’t want to leave and I had the resources to elevate that suffering but reverence to God called me to a different choice.
Penney…no worries, sister! It is such a mystery, truly, this being willing to suffer. And your choice to look to your mother’s best interest rather than her situation is an example the paradox that is suffering servanthood.
Janet, thanks for the refresher on Wesley…Amen, indeed!
Matt…two things, no three…don’t get me laughing now–this is serious business!
Be blessed.
Two years ago I moved across the States to plant a church. Six weeks before me and my family arrived my dad died of a massive heart attack. Devastating. My relationship with him was burgeoning due to the fact that we had reconciled many things over the course of several years. However, I must say that I grieved so deeply and part of the grief cycle is fighting and coming to terms with the feelings that loss brings. There is this longing, this deep-seated desire to remedy the frustration, but you can’t. I had to accept it and in accepting it I admitted my finiteness and my own mortality. Suffering in all aspects usually entails loss of some kind. I cannot tell you how valuable it was to have a pastor reorient my suffering in the light of the cross at the appropriate time. Though it was a very difficult 12 months or so it was a time where I could, more than any other time, see the hand of God literally sustaining me as I simply tried to accomplish things at my job and be a husband.
Jason, thank you for sharing. I pray that you continue to see God’s loving hand sustaining you as you face each day, step by step, doing what must be done one thing at a time.
Be blessed, brother.