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5 Responses to “the heart of falsehood”

1. Mike Gastin on September 28th, 2008 6:50 am

   Hi Al,

   What aspect of fundamentalism are you referring to when you tie it to deception? I understand the reference to prosperity doctrine, but fundamentalism is such a big bucket. Can you explain? Thanks!

   M~

2. Alan Hirsch on September 28th, 2008 7:41 am

   Mike, I believe fundamentalism does NOT reflect the ethos or the pathos of the biblical idea of faith. It cannot hold paradoxical truth in tension, has a profound tendency towards violence, demonstrates an un-Christlike lack of grace/mercy, is deeply moralistic, and is normally quite nationalistic. The Bible on the other hand, deals well with paradoxical tensions and nuances that the fundie can neither see, nor tolerate, largely because of its childish, black and white, view of reality. And also because it is highly selective in its appropriation of aspects of the Scripture–curiously similar to its mortal opponent, theological liberalism!! Both sides ’see’ what they want to see, and each has enough truth to make it palatable, but both are in fact heresies. Having said that, I believe that liberalism is the more insidious of the two, because it is far more subtle.

   Besides, in fundamentalism it seems that there is not a lot of fun and a whole lot of mental. In other words, it is toxic faith and creates profound unhappiness.

   True??

3. Daniel on September 29th, 2008 2:56 am

   To say that a false prophet is not Godless, from my perspective, is to ignore the repeated chastisements from God of the false prophets in the bible, both in the OT and NT. Yes, the false prophets and false teachers are deceived, but like you said, both the teachers and the audience believe what they WANT to believe, indeed, the deceive themselves. God explains to us in his word that is the condition of the human heart that actually steers the mind into accepting a a given doctrine or practice. If we have the spirit of Christ within us, (and are thus not Godless…) than we cannot be defined by a life that embraces that which is contrary to the Truth. All of the false teachings and movements that you described, (the fundies, libs, cults, and health & wealth crowd) all are false teachings that prey on the basic fallen desires of mankind. The Pharisees preyed on our inherent pride and self-righteousness. The false prophets of Baal appealed to lust and human appetites. There is nothing new under the sun. Only the packaging has changed….

   peace,
   Daniel

4. Alan Hirsch on September 29th, 2008 4:19 am

   Yes Daniel, may we all have the shalom of God that disturbs our self-deception!

   Again I think the truth is more veiled or complex that a simple ‘all prosperity teachers are godless souls’. People, even Christian people, have some degree of self-delusion. It is one of the works of the Spirit to root this out of our souls.

5. Erik on September 30th, 2008 5:56 am

   A week ago a group of friends and I rented a space and spent a weekend simply being a presence in a local ‘Body, Soul, and Spirit Expo’. Yes, it was mainly made up of New Age practices and I must say some incredibly talented artists who equated there work to having divine influences (in some ways I have no doubts about it!). That said I could not help but identify with the false bravado leading their “prophetic” statements.

   The main drive that seemed to fuel their spiritualism was to find a place or people who found them valuable or of importance. In most cases that was measured by some form of worldly measure whether it was transactional wealth, bartering abilities, or numbered following. The stated product was hope, success, purpose, and perhaps most of all health or healing but; underlying it was always self driven reassurances to identity and social place.

   Are they godless? That is to say without God? I struggle to say yes as God’s gifting and presence was all around in talents, abilities a fruits. Even “Christianity” had its parts to play in many of the cultural spaces and beliefs. It was more like a holistic blindness with a loss to creational identity and Lordship. Religion, with Jesus included, was a possessional commodity which was meant to be purchased with the intent of self fulfillment.

   O.K. so here is the danger zone of sorts. Is the “church” any different? Do we treat the practices of community any differently then these “false prophets” of the New Age?

   I do not mean to say that there are not authentic followers of Jesus who are out there in the church. I am sure there are many. I simply am thinking we need to look closer at the ways in which we practice and project the idea being a community of Jesus followers without catching ourselves in the same blindedness of false prophetic purpose, hope, success, and creational identity (Jesus is Lord!!!).

   I’m reminded of Kathleen Norris’ comment, “One so often hears people say, ‘I can’t handle it,’ when they reject a biblical image of God as Father, as Mother, as Lord or Judge; God as lover, as angry or jealous, God on a cross. I find this choice of words revealing, however real the pain they reflect: if we seek a God we can ‘handle,’ that will be exactly what we get. A God we can manipulate, suspiciously like ourselves, the wideness of whose mercy we’ve cut down to size.”

   Questions I am wondering… Does false prophesy mainly come from individual blindness or corporate practices? Does Jesus view false prophesy as an exclusionary identification or needed fulfillment to identity or purpose (both individual and communal)? How do we inbody/incatnate that understanding (again both individually and communally)?

   My sincere apologies if this is too long of a response!!!

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